DE Talk

Translating Military Skills to Corporate Needs

• DirectEmployers Association • Season 7 • Episode 4

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Despite having a true understanding of their value in the workplace, employers often lack the visibility and engagement needed to successfully reach veteran job seekers. In this episode of the DE Talk Podcast, listen in as Recruit Rooster's Ruth Toombs and Elliott Obermaier discuss the importance of understanding military skills and how they transition to civilian careers, the misconceptions in hiring veterans, and the need for optimized application processes to go beyond good intentions and build a recruitment strategy that truly works.

DirectEmployers (00:00):

Get ready. The DE Talk podcast starts now, insightful conversations and dialogue, helping you put the human factor back in HR.

(00:09):

What if the biggest barrier to hiring great talent isn't a shortage of qualified candidates, but a failure to recognize the skills right in front of you? Today we're talking about veteran hiring and why it's not just a checkbox exercise. Elliot Obermaier and Ruth Toombs from Recruit Rooster are taking over the podcast to reveal why so many companies are missing out on exceptional talent by not knowing how to translate military experience into corporate value.

(00:36):

Discover why the application process itself might be driving away the exact leaders you need, how underemployment is costing veterans and employers, and what it really takes to build veteran recruitment strategies that work. If you've ever wondered how to tap into a talent pool filled with proven leaders, this conversation will change how you think about veteran hiring.

(00:55):

Welcome to the DE Talk podcast.

Elliott Obermaier (00:58):

Hi, all. This is Elliot Obermaier, one of the business development reps at Recruit Rooster by DirectEmployers. We're a recruitment marketing firm and one of the leading consultative firms as far as veteran recruitment goes. And today we're going to be talking a little bit about veteran, and I'm joined with my colleague Ruth Toombs.

Ruth Toombs (01:13):

Hi there, Ruth here. I've worked in recruitment marketing and veteran hiring technology. Gosh, I'm dating myself probably about 15 years. And today we really want to dig in and talk about a few things. So there's a lot of common oversights in veteran hiring. We want to talk about what they are and of course, how to fix them, and also how do we align military skills with corporate job requirements, also career websites, optimizing that for a veteran experience and the role of testimonials and talent communities as well. We've been doing this for quite a while, so I feel like there's always new information and technology available to really help with veteran hiring as well as military spouses, and also that rapport building piece, which is the family as an entirety. And really thinking on this Elliot, and feel free, we can kind of just toss this back and forth first.

Elliott Obermaier (02:02):

Yeah, absolutely.

Ruth Toombs (02:02):

I hope you had your coffee. I'm on my second

Elliott Obermaier (02:05):

Cup a hundred percent. I'm on my first, which is rare for me today.

Ruth Toombs (02:09):

We've done a few in the past, but Elliot and I, we have a really good, strong standing as far as going and speaking together at industry related conferences. And we've done this a few times too. So just taking a look at really veteran population. In this previous year in 2024, there were about 17.6 million men and women, and they were veterans accounting for about, that's about 7% of the civilian population. That also represents millions of stories and skills and service. So that's a huge piece as well. I'll pause a second and let's just talk about first, why is veteran hiring important? I mean, we all have these high level ideas, but we can really get a little bit more granular too. I'll let you kind of

Elliott Obermaier (02:53):

Absolutely.

Ruth Toombs (02:53):

Yeah, hop in there too.

Elliott Obermaier (02:54):

Absolutely. I think it starts in a lot of ways. You're looking at, you've got actual requirements with veteran hiring. That's something that a lot of companies look forward to, and I think that that's kind of the fear driven, oh, we have to meet certain requirements. There are certain OFCCP regulations that require X number of veteran hires a year, and while that's a great theoretical thing that should drive companies, I think at the root of it, veteran hiring is so important based on the skill sets and the personalities and the qualities that veterans bring. We shouldn't hire veterans just to meet a number, right? Veterans should be something should be wanted. Members of every team's community, and most of the time they're going to be incredibly valuable, incredibly valuable teammates and contributors to the workforce. So I think that is one of the real reasons that veterans should be looking to get hired more and that companies should be looking to hire veterans just beyond specific compliance and regulation standpoint.

Ruth Toombs (03:47):

Oh, absolutely. And of course, the regulations still remain for those federal contractors, but I know there's a lot of organizations that are still looking to add this very sought after population to their workforce. VEVRAA and section 503, they still remain active and enforceable. So there's definitely that utilization goal per job group for individuals with disabilities as well as veterans. So that's something to keep in mind, of course, for federal contractors. I noticed some of the listeners here have been doing this for a lifetime, where others, of course might be just dipping their toes in this water, and it's very different of course this year with the current administration. So absolutely, I totally agree with you, and I think it's really important to also drop the fluff and start utilizing technology. It's really about winning trust of veterans spouses as well as individuals with disabilities. So veteran hiring, like you said, there's those big pieces, those obvious areas where we can talk more about that too, where they add so much value to your organization and it's the right thing to do, right?

Elliott Obermaier (04:48):

Yeah.

Ruth Toombs (04:48):

You're supporting veterans. Hiring veterans demonstrates a real commitment to supporting those who have served our nation, benefiting the company's reputation. There are a number of areas like potential tax breaks, so the work opportunity tax credit, there's salary subsidies during training, depending on certain requirements. And again, a lot of these are based on specific requirements. We can definitely share more information offline to anyone who's interested. But salary reimbursement as well, there's a special employer incentive program. So absolutely, there's a lot of areas where it really matters, but real inclusion also I think equals real results for employers as a whole. Right.

Elliott Obermaier (05:26):

Oh my gosh. Yeah. I think one of the other things too that people don't necessarily think of with veterans as far as the skillsets that they bring, they're coming from a very disciplined, rigorous environment that is high pressure, high intensity, very much team driven. So a lot of McKinsey study that was recently performed in 2025, veteran teams with veterans are 25% more likely to outperform financial returns. Veterans also have a 7% lower attrition rate. So when you're actually thinking about hiring veterans as a company, it's so much more than just, oh, we're meeting a goal. We're adding to the diversity of our team. You're really hiring, I think, meaningful employees that quite frankly are probably used to a much more intense work environment and still going to bring that same level of intensity and focus as far as collaboration and getting the job done.

Ruth Toombs (06:13):

And think about even our small but mighty organization here, recruit rooster, culture fit is huge, and having the ability to be a team player, also be a self-starter, all of those buzzwords. So think about the level of interacting with diverse populations that veterans automatically bring, right? All status levels of how you were raised, environment, family, religion, race, doesn't matter. So just having that ability, for lack of a better terms, kind of like a chameleon, you're able to blend into your environment. You're able to also bring so much value too.

Elliott Obermaier (06:49):

Yeah, absolutely. And I think too, from a cultural standpoint, organizations are looking to change culture in some ways, to be more productive, to be more efficient, and to have a way where their culture is a little bit more focused and a little bit more driven. Veterans can be an exceptional place as far as bringing people in that will set a new precedent and set a new tone within your own internal culture. So both from a fit standpoint, but also from what you're looking to change. If you're an organization that wants to grow in new ways, I think veterans are just so exceptionally valuable.

Ruth Toombs (07:18):

Oh, absolutely. And some stats here, of course, a large portion of veterans report that finding employment when they enter the civilian workforce is one of the most difficult parts of transitioning. 55% of veterans report are finding employment being the most difficult, being the most difficult. This is SHRM stats, and 59% of employers reported that veterans are stronger workers once hired than non-veterans. I'm not a veteran, and I love the aspect of having somebody who actually can bring that competitive nature to an employer too. I think that's a big piece too.

Elliott Obermaier (07:52):

Oh my gosh, yeah, absolutely.

Ruth Toombs (07:54):

And I would say my little brother, a lot of my family members have been a part of the armed forces, and I remember when my little brother transitioned out, it's probably been close to a decade ago, there was so much more to it than just looking for employment. It was also trying to kind of unravel that very day-to-day scheduled life, and then trying to enter something that's wide open with choices and possibilities. So I can imagine it makes sense why that would be, again, it's stressful for all of us, right? Anybody who's doing it. So you add those layers and components also a lot of times relocation. Huge. Huge.

Elliott Obermaier (08:28):

Yeah, absolutely. Could not agree, could not agree more.

Ruth Toombs (08:31):

So I think some of the things that we have discussed with some of the veterans that we've had within our organization, a conversation with employers, some of their frustrations that they've seen among their veteran populations that they have as a part as employees. There's a couple of areas that I hear consistently, the lack of understanding, right? So recruiters and hiring managers, they don't necessarily fully grasp how roles align with corporate job functions. I mean, I'm sure you've heard the same thing, right?

Elliott Obermaier (09:00):

Oh my gosh, yeah. A thousand times over. Well, I think that for more than anything, what a lot of organizations don't really understand what they're doing is connecting with veterans by speaking to veteran language.

(09:13):

I think that a lot of organizations simply list their roles and market their jobs in the way that they would market to everybody, and don't necessarily make that extra step effort to connect and start speaking about what veteran experiences might've been and how that can easily translate to a corporate position. I think a lot of different companies that are hiring don't really recognize that veterans have the experience. They have everything that could be put into place as far as a team and a leadership skillset. But when it's not listed in the job description in a way that applies to a veteran's role or what they might've had within the military, if it's focused specifically on granular things about the role itself or corporate experiences that don't specify on leading a team, focusing on project management skills or areas that are specifically high intense and work pressure environments, those are all sorts of languages that veterans can relate to and clearly identify, oh, I'm experienced in this. I have these skill sets that I've learned within the military.

(10:10):

This is why this would translate. I think that when organizations do start taking that extra step, that's when that gray line of how veterans can see themselves within your organization can start becoming a little less opaque and a lot clearer. And I think too that there are so many different steps to take with that. It can just be simply changing your job description language, or it can go so far as actually using different military skills, translator tools or partnering with different military translation, like different types of software and services within different career sites or within different veteran translation and job board organizations to really, essentially what I'm saying is that you can go as above and beyond as you would like to as an organization.

Ruth Toombs (10:51):

Oh, for sure. And taking a look too, you had mentioned the unrealistic expectations. There's so much experience again that you had mentioned doesn't necessarily translate into civilian workforce. So we have to take the opportunity to use true grit, get in the trenches, understand your roles, how they can align, but also, again, yes, utilizing technology. There's a lot out there. Employers, a lot of times they require certification or degree. For example, sales position, we need to have four year sales experience or what have you. It doesn't always translate. They have that experience. But an MOS or MOC may not totally demonstrate that when you're using an overly complex job description.

Elliott Obermaier (11:28):

Absolutely

Ruth Toombs (11:29):

Insufficient outreach. So let's think about it. If we're just saying we slap this little logo at the bottom that says military friendly employer, that's not necessarily quite a lot

(11:39):

And quite enough. So making sure that companies are actively engaging with veteran communities or even military transition programs. There's a lot of those. There's a lot of those out there. Some of those are even free. Again, we can have those conversations. If anyone ever has interest in knowing more, there's a lot available out there. And it's tough for all of us, everyone. So imagine, again, this extra layer. So this is me on my little soapbox like I typically do, but I urge everyone who has a part of the talent acquisition process, especially from the digital perspective, take a drive in your candidate supply seat, apply for a job, see how it works. Is it good? Is it easy? Do you have 19 clicks before I even remotely get to your applicant tracking system and do it on your phone? Everybody needs to imply on your phone, right? Because that is just the era we live in. I mean, it's super easy to go, well, this does not work for me. This is too many hoops of fire to jump through, so I'm going to swipe left.

Elliott Obermaier (12:41):

Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. I think that that is one of the most important aspects of just veteran hiring and hiring in general now is how optimized are you for a mobile experience? How optimized are you to reach? There's so many different generations within the workforce now we're looking at Gen Z is really starting to enter now that we're in 2025, that's 25% of the workforce is a generation that grew up with a phone. If you're not focusing on being able to apply and focusing on allowing those job seekers to apply easily and quickly, you're falling behind very, very quickly from a TA standpoint.

Ruth Toombs (13:15):

Elliott, do you know how old

Elliott Obermaier (13:16):

[inaudible applies, the better.

Ruth Toombs (13:17):

Do you know how old I was when I had my first cell phone? Just guess

Elliott Obermaier (13:21):

I'm going to guess that you were at least 18 years old.

Ruth Toombs (13:23):

Spot on. I was 18, maybe 19. I think I was around 19. And it had the antenna that you had to pull

Elliott Obermaier (13:29):

Out of it. It wasn't a flip phone, it wasn't an iPhone.

Ruth Toombs (13:32):

Oh, no, no. The flip phones came later. Came later. Oh, no. This is very almost prehistoric. Yeah, it's so funny to think about that. Oh yeah, for

Elliott Obermaier (13:41):

Sure. I'm not going to say I'm, say what that experience was like for me.

Ruth Toombs (13:47):

Oh my gosh. But yes, absolutely. Making sure, like you said, even an accessible experience. True as well. Universal design benefits, everyone. Universal design is not just for individuals with disabilities, although it's geared towards them. It's the ADA's recommendations for that, but it makes everyone's lives easier too. Having an intuitive interface, making sure everything is spans and contracts as it's supposed to. No pinching and squeezing, that's so important. So important. Yes.

Elliott Obermaier (14:13):

Oh my gosh. Yeah.

Ruth Toombs (14:14):

Take a drive. Take a drive. That's what I think. So we've obviously talked about some of the issues, obviously the benefits of hiring, some of the issues that come with, and we're just literally grazing the tip of the iceberg, and I understand that. So as far as what can organizations do, there's a ton we can do, but we can dig into a couple of those and we can take a look at this together. So Elliot, we have these conversations all the time, but organizations I would definitely suggest start at the foundation of your organization. We have great technology. That to me is truly the icing on the cake. You've got to have that grassroots in the trenches, people that are really working, do outreach and have conversations with veterans, transitioning veterans in the civilian workforce. And I think it's important to provide training for recruiters and hiring managers on interpreting military experience. That's a tough place, as we mentioned earlier.

Elliott Obermaier (15:06):

Absolutely. Absolutely. And I think with focusing on all of these, I think one of the most important aspects is how you're bringing those people in, how you're recruiting, where you're posting your jobs, if you're taking all of the right steps. I don't think you can take almost a half effort in approach on all of this. I think that you have to really focus on, it's great if you're just listing your jobs on different types of job boards. If you're putting them

Ruth Toombs (15:31):

On military com that necessary to diversify. We totally get it right. We need to do that too. But

Elliott Obermaier (15:36):

What are the next steps that actually make your company stand out as someone that is focused on hiring beyond just meeting the requirements? I think when you look at military spouses, the military spousal rate is 21%, which is incredibly high, believe it's much higher than

Ruth Toombs (15:52):

That

Elliott Obermaier (15:53):

Consistent unemployment rate. And nearly half, 47% of military spouses respond stating that working at a veteran friendly corporation that has a military spouse program that had the veteran recruitment program was one of the most effective ways for them to avoid unemployment strategies. And even if you, I think going beyond from the company perspective, even if you have these spousal programs, that's awesome. If you don't market that, spouses aren't going to find that. Right? And I think that that's where so many companies fall short. And when I have these conversations with people that are interested in some of our hiring tools, so many of them say, oh, well, we have these veteran programs, we have these ERGs. And I tell them, I'm like, I spent an hour and a half today researching your organization and your jobs

Ruth Toombs (16:34):

Why don't I see it?

Elliott Obermaier (16:34):

Yeah. Why can't I see any of these anywhere? So I think that that's one of the most, if you're not taking the steps to showcase that you have these types of employment programs for veterans or military spouses, even if you're meeting the regulations, you're falling short.

Ruth Toombs (16:49):

Oh, absolutely. And like you said from the beginning, it's not just about reg numbers. Technology can help you hit those, but it's also bringing valuable talent into your workforce. Oh my gosh. And we have some pretty prominent well-known employers that we work with that everywhere you go on their career site is a call to action veterans apply here. Here's our veteran partners providing we have a military skills translation tool. For those of you that have not had conversations with us, that allows transitioning veterans to align the skills that they learn in the armed forces to your open roles. Also, some base mapping technology that helps military spouses as well as veterans find work within your organization that are near a military bases. So all that stuff. But it's also about just a dedicated space, not just putting that little logo like military friendly, but also and doing it across all your platforms, providing that information. Let's think about all the vendors that you work with. If you're putting it on LinkedIn, on all kinds of social, put it in your job description, put it out there for anytime you're having events, there's tons of available. Just creating that space where they feel valued.

Elliott Obermaier (17:59):

Yeah. Oh my gosh. Yeah, absolutely. And I think that that's what's going to go above and beyond. And if you're targeting that with various job boards that you're focusing on, or if you're going to career fairs to target veterans, being prepared to gather information from those spots, being prepared to showcase why you're going to those, having answers about why your company is looking to hire veterans. So that way your company doesn't come across as just another organization that is hiring veterans to meet a regulation.

Ruth Toombs (18:25):

So there's tons of stuff out there that we can do to help, but I think absolutely, it would also behoove us to really kind of focus on service connected disabilities among veterans. And

(18:34):

Over 31% of all veterans had a service connected disability. That was in August of 2024 where the studies were done. So that's 5.5 million veterans that live with this service connected disability. And what's more with that as well, is it also kind of creates a segue for us to talk about underemployment. Just speaking with, we have veterans within our workspace that we have conversations with family, friends, underemployment is a very real piece. I think the majority of veterans that I've known have come out of the armed forces, and they have all these skills. Again, all these things we've talked about, they don't align necessarily with some of the speech and jargon that's used in these job descriptions. So they're working like stocking shelves. So my little brother did a lot of that until he was able to find full-time employment. So that's a big piece as well. So that's where some of that flexibility, if you can provide that as an employer organizations and be open to that. They're working maybe part-time somewhere, but they're perfectly open to having conversations about full-time employment as well.

Elliott Obermaier (19:40):

Absolutely.

Ruth Toombs (19:41):

Yeah. A big piece that I see too is I've seen a number of companies doing this. If you have a train to hire program, we all want to see it. Everybody wants to see it, right? Put that out there, put it in all of your job descriptions, put it on your career website, channel, all of that back.

Elliott Obermaier (19:56):

There's a great study that I highly recommend that anybody is reading this, the SURFACE department at Syracuse University did for military spouse in the employment landscape that they published in March of this year. One of the examples that they talked about was how a lot of veterans were looking specifically for internship programs to get skillsets in those kinds of companies. And I think that if you have those market them, make sure that veterans can, veterans are going to be more than willing to say, let's definitely look at internship programs or other trained to hire programs, that I think that that would be one of the most valuable ways. It's one of the most valuable ways to showcase that you're willing and that you're going to take all of the steps that a veteran might need, and that veterans are also willing to take that time.

Ruth Toombs (20:39):

And also being really aware that there are, and there's a website for this as well, national Veterans Training Institute. Again, it's going to depend on the size of your company, what you offer, but some nonprofits, universities, labor unions, labor unions is a big one I know as well. And industries, they've created essentially a no cost job training and placement program for veterans to put them into jobs in what we consider critically unmanned industries and sectors, which a lot of time is skilled labor and trade. So definitely there's a lot out there that you can make sure that you're getting, it's all about visibility, right?

Elliott Obermaier (21:12):

Absolutely.

Ruth Toombs (21:13):

Even if you have these programs, if nobody's going to really see them, they're not a part of your everyday hiring practices and talent acquisition process, then it's just not really going to get the results that you're looking for.

Elliott Obermaier (21:26):

Yeah, no, you could not agree more. You're spot on that. And I think that that's something that is consistency and maintaining regulations with it all and maintaining regularity is one of the most important and impactful pieces to really improve. And I think an actual veteran hiring program, rather than just saying, oh, this is going to be an amazing one-time push that we need to focus on veteran hiring for three months. That's not going to do anything within an organization. It's something that takes years to develop and years to acquire. I think

(21:54):

One of the things that I always think about is, so one of the companies that we've worked with in the past with our military skills translator tool, they started with just veteran hiring was an initiative at their organization and that their TA team and HR team really wanted to focus on. And so they started with just a military skills translator piece that they embedded. And then eventually that led to them over the course of five years, they built out an entire ERG page. They built out a military base locator map for veteran spouses. They built out employee testimonial videos. So many more things that added onto this military and veteran recruitment strategy. They took time, right? It's not going to come overnight, but it took time. And eventually by your five, they had this incredibly robust recruitment strategy that allowed them to hire so many more veterans.

Ruth Toombs (22:42):

Oh, for sure. And some organization, I would say the majority of organizations, it's very shared challenges when they try to hire,

(22:50):

Recruit, and hire veterans. Self-identification is a big one. And here's the thing, if you create a very robust, engaging experience, especially on your career website and your job descriptions, any of your outreach, as well as add tracking mechanisms to that, if they're using these tools and technology like translators, things of that nature, you're pretty sure already that they're going to be veterans. And talent communities are a big piece as well. Self-identification is not the greatest. And the reason is, of course, because there can be some misinformation about necessarily hiring veterans or maybe a company doesn't feel like it's going to be the right fit. So I don't think everybody feels comfortable sharing. They're a veteran necessarily, especially if you don't have some dedicated pages and things of that you may not want to like, oh, well maybe they're not looking for this kind of experience.

(23:40):

So making sure they have that is a big piece as well. And developing roadmaps for veteran job on your career websites really create that structure is huge. Like, oh, we value veterans. Here's what to expect here. We're going to have a recruiter that's going to reach out to you specifically and talk more about this if you have that opportunity. There's also, again, capturing relevant talent, every talent, every kind of talent, but also with veterans capturing just the right amount through a talent community. And then of course, staying in front of them with new and relevant jobs and reaching out to them on a personal level.

Elliott Obermaier (24:13):

Oh my gosh. Yeah. And it's something that I always think is really interesting. DPI Staffing put out a study on this last year that veterans companies with veteran referral programs are much more likely to hire veteran job seekers. Similarly, in this kind of way that you're talking about staying in front of veterans, showcasing what you all have and showcasing the processes that veterans would come into and have an understanding of as they're going through the recruitment process. If you have people that are already veterans reaching out to other veterans, or if you have people that have worked with veterans or hired other veterans, reaching out to veterans, creating that referral, that's easier. Establishing that community far before the hiring process even dives into a further detail. And I think that that's something that's so valuable and so important and something that you can't weigh enough.

Ruth Toombs (24:58):

For sure. And one thing to keep in mind too is we get close to wrapping this up because we can really talk about this for a long time. So according to the Department of Labor, 66% of veterans are 45 years or older. And because of that, they're at least interested in entry-level positions for obvious reasons. So I notice a lot of companies in the organizations, they do tend to gear their talent acquisition for veterans in that entry level space, which is absolutely necessary too, depending on your company. But employers that are more likely to build out job descriptions that include veterans as leaders, will be more likely to actually hire them. So keep that in mind too, is that there is a large range of talent out there, depending on experience level. Oh my gosh. Right? And it's not all about, in that case, military skills, translators. It's all about gearing your job descriptions toward that veteran talent that's more tenured.

Elliott Obermaier (25:50):

Totally. I mean, almost a third of veteran job seekers are not unemployed, but underemployed, right? Yes. And it goes back to that statement of how do you connect and how do you showcase to veterans and how do you as a talent acquisition professional, understand that your jobs are incredibly doable, right. For these veterans. Veterans are incredibly qualified.

Ruth Toombs (26:10):

Well, I tell you, I finished my third cup. I'm shaking like a leaf. Alright, I'm about to start my second. Oh my goodness. So thank you everyone for joining us to learn more about some of the issues that veterans face in the hiring process and also how to translate that to military experience. But again, thank you all for joining us. We look forward to engaging you the next time.

Elliott Obermaier (26:32):

Absolutely. Thank you all so much. We had a blast and look forward to talking more in the future.

DirectEmployers (26:36):

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